Chinese Memes: An Interview with u/Elmwow
Hello! Thank you for agreeing to the interview. First you need to know is that I’m not so far away from you: I’m from Russia, so I will reveal the situation with memes in our country, and there will be some cultural exchange. I hope it will be cool!
Sure, me too.
So, I'll start from afar: what's up with the Internet in China? You have the Golden Shield Project, including a powerful firewall that forces people to use internal services, right?
Something similar to that. We can’t view something like YouTube, Reddit, Twitter etc without a VPN. I’m using one right now in order to talk to you.
Is it legal? I mean, don't you afraid of that, do you?
How should I say this, hmm. It’s kinda complicated. VPNs are banned, but if you managed to download one, and use it privately, you won’t get into trouble. It’s nothing if you use it for proper use, like watching YouTube videos, but if you do something like download videos form, for example, Pornhub, then it’s illegal. It’s not like written in the law book or anything, it’s just unwritten rules.
Okay. What do you do on the "outer web"? Browsing memes, looking for some entertainment news, watching videos, something else?
Yeah, that’s pretty much it. I mostly browse Reddit and watch YouTube videos.
Are you aware of the meme situation in China? Judging by the fact that it is the world's largest country by population, and the Internet is used by 730 million people (~50% of total population), memes should be really popular there. As for Russia, we have 84-86 million Internet users out of 144 million people, and the memes here is a cult (the cargo one, though).
Yes. We do have quite a lot of memes here. There are also some memes from other countries like Japan.
I've heard about the Baozou Manhua website which is posting Rage Comics, and it's really famous. To be honest, I found it in May 2018 during one scandal, and was surprised by the fact that Rage Comics are still a thing. Can you tell me more about it and other websites?
Well, these are just things like the Troll Face, Derp Face and things with similar art styles, and people use them to make memes. Most of the pictures are still from other countries. It’s less of a thing now, it’s not as topical as before. Personally, I wouldn’t call them “memes”. I think it’s more of a format for people to express their feelings. There isn’t much background to them.
Since they are a means of expression, they are still memes, maybe even deeper than those "funny pictures".
I would say it’s deeper, but not by much.
And what about other websites? Are there any dominant services which produce memes? For example, where was the "Chinese Loss" born? As you could guess, that's my favorite Chinese meme.
The meme itself, the “I want them all” meme, is from a Steven Chou movie. There isn’t an exact website, Chinese memes are like any other memes, created in various corners of the Internet. By the way, I didn’t describe it properly, it’s like a “It’s free real estate“ meme with a little touch of Loss in it. For example, two girls, both very hot. Which one will you pick? Boom! The picture of “I want them all” is at the bottom.
Where are the memes appearing? Are there imageboards, forums, social networks, and so on? Can you give some examples of them?
Yeah, memes are appearing in places that you mentioned. Social media, video websites, etc. Like Weibo, Baidu Tieba (which is like a Chinese Reddit), BiliBili (a video website similar to NicoNico Douga), and other social medias and video websites, similar to other places on Earth.
How the usual foreigner can find the Chinese memes besides using the services above? Do you have a local Know Your Meme or a wiki-project that systematizes memes? The only website I've found was Moegirlpedia which covers a part of the Internet slang.
Not really. Moegirlpedia is the most known website about these things. The other sites are much less famous. I think so, at least.
Are there any memeologists that analyze memes and web culture as such?
Yes, there are some.
Do they have blogs? If so, can you give me the links?
The only one I know is a content creator on BiliBili. He has a show called “梗百科” which introduce memes. I don’t really know anyone with blogs, though. These are his video submissions.
Do you want to be the one? I mean, since you have access to the foreign Internet, you do have an opportunity to make Chinese memes more popular here. As for me, I would really like a separate subreddit in which you talk about native memes and thus enlighten the people.
Maybe a month later, that’s my winter vacation. I’m a high school student, and I don’t really have much time at school. Just maybe. I rarely have spare time now.
Hope you will succeed! Judging by your words, meme culture is quite developed, but it requires a room to grow further. Can you tell me if Chinese memes have changed and, if so, how much?
Not by much. Some older memes just have less popularity. There are some classic memes that’s quite old and still doing fine, while new memes are still coming in. The memes doesn’t change much, but some memes popularity changes over time. Most of them, that is.
Can you give an example of a fresh meme and a really old one?
Old meme: the ”金坷垃” meme. It’s basically an overly exaggerated fertilizer ad. “坷垃” is a Chinese farmer slang, it means “soil”, “金” here means “gold” or “golden”, so it basically means “golden soil”. What’s meme worthy about it, is that in the ad, an African dude and a Japanese dude stopped a truck, driven by an American guy. They said what’s good about this fertilizer, all in Chinese, and what they said, and their accents are hilarious. This meme usually gets edited into music. There’s a lot of new memes, and I don’t really know which one to pick. The source of them are all over the place. From TV shows, to League Of Legends tournaments, so I couldn’t come up with a representative one. A lot of new memes have been occuring recently, that is.
How long have you been browsing the Internet? Do you remember Yao Ming, a Chinese basketball player who became a prototype of the 'Fuck That Guy' meme? Was he proclaimed a national Internet hero when the Rage Comics got to China?
I’ve been browsing the Internet for, maybe 7, 8 years, or so, I’m 16 now. Of course I know Yao Ming. He’s not the only one with a “memeful” face. There’s also a Korean actor, Choi Seong-guk, and a Japanese voice actress, Hanazawa Kana who also have made meme facial expressions.
Judging by some articles, I can assume that political events is the main catalyst of the Chinese memes, and the political memes are more popular than anything else. Am I right?
Just like any other countries, sources of memes in China are also diverse. Sure, there are some political memes, but they sure aren’t the “main catalyst”.
Do you think Chinese memes are going with the times or falling behind Western Internet phenomena? For example, are there Surreal or Deep Fried, or maybe other style memes in your country?
Well, to my knowledge, the memes in China don't have too many different styles such as your examples, but they are mostly going with the time. New memes are still coming in from various sources. Movies, politics, news, all those current events, you name it. But like some memes, the source of a meme in China can also be from the past.
Personally, I like the simplicity of your memes, though they don't have such graphic diversity. As I understand, the lingual memes are especially popular, since there is a plenty of dialects in China.
Yes, you’re absolutely correct. But the dialects aren’t the main factor of verbal memes. Sure, there are some, but most of the “meme quotes” are still from sources like “We are number one”, “I’m gay”, and etc. Similar to these meme sources, that is. It’s because the phrase itself, not the accent or the dialect, combined with graphical expressions.
By the way, I see this meme pretty surreal.
Oh, this meme. Let me explain. It came from a dude, recording a video about his feelings after he got dumped by his GF. He was quite sad,and he said “I feel bad, and I want to cry” in Chinese, but his accent made the words ”难受想哭” (I feel bad and I want to cry) sound like “蓝瘦香菇” which literally stands for ”blue skinny mushroom”.
Does the state use memes for its own purposes, like propaganda?
Maybe, I’ve seen a military propaganda with memes once. But I’m not sure if it’s made by officials.
You've mentioned Japanese memes. Do you know any memes from neighbor countries and Asia as a whole?
Not really, I only know a few of them. And to my knowledge, the memes in Asia (especially Japanese memes) are separated. There are different circles of memes and meme users. There are definitely some anime memes, and the more retro “bokete” memes. And some others like Billy Herrington memes, and something similar as well. These are all I know.
Ah, the Gachimuchi memes. I know them well, since they've been very popular in Russia. Is there a strict line between mass (normie) and dank memes in the Chinese Internet? After some research I stumbled upon many articles describing memes (1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8). Can you explain either those are mass memes or local? Personally, I won't believe they can put something obscure and peculiar there, therefore creating misconception of your web culture with foreigners like me.
Yes, there’s a distinct difference between normies and dank memes in China. In these links, the memes are widely used. Nothing obscure.
Which side are you on? Do you consume obscure and dank local memes? If hard to answer, you can identify yourself via the Meme Compass.
Apparently, I’m a wholesome normie... Maybe it’s because of the cultural differences. Chinese memes are rarely offensive.
So the dank memes can't be as edgy as the Western memes?
Yes, they can’t. Maybe it’s because of historical reasons.
Censorship or mentality? Because in Russia we have some rude and edgy memes here, and they're not even dank or something.
Both, I guess.
Do you know any compatriots who browse the outer web? Are your friends into the Western memes?
2, maybe 3 of them. They’re quite interested in Western memes. I frequently share some with them too.
How did you meet foreign memes? Did you experience culture shock or something?
Well, I met foreign memes through YouTubers actually. The first YouTuber I watched was Annoying Orange. Then it’s Smosh, Pewdiepie, and then there’s a lot of other people. I wasn’t shocked, I find them quite amusing. It was a long time ago, when I first found AO. Probably when I was, maybe 10. And there’s some uploaders in China who introduce foreign memes.
The final question: since you're a PewDiePie fan, do you think Felix will remain the most subscribed channel on YouTube? And what the whole community and the website itself will lose if T-Series wins this battle?
Although I like the Swedish man, but I still have to face the truth. He’s gonna lose eventually, considering how quickly T-series are gaining subscribers. But I don’t think it’s that big of a deal. We’re all memeing it like it’s the WW3 of the Internet, but Pewdiepie himself once said in one of his video that he doesn’t actually care about being the top YouTuber or not. Personally, I’m supporting Pewdiepie, not only because I’m his fan, but it’s also because of this campaign is a duel between original creators and corporate entities. And I support original creators.
Yeah, those are just numbers, but in my opinion, by them for years PewDiePie has been representing us, the community, the very concept of YouTube. T-Series is a corporation, and it's not a surprise they will win, sooner or later, just bringing boring statistics because of the India population. Well, that's it! Thank you for the interview, now I know a lot more about some aspects of Chinese web culture. It's been a pleasure to talk to you. Hope you'll think about the subreddit, since the idea is very interesting. See ya!
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